1¶
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF FLORIDA WEST PALM BEACH DIVISION¶
IN RE: OPERATION LEAP YEAR¶
Grand Jury #07-103 (WPB)¶
West Palm Beach, Florida¶
Tuesday, February 6, 2007¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE （954） 467-8204¶
EFTA00085291¶
2¶
PROCEDINGS¶
The sworn testimony of was taken before the Federal Grand Jury, West Palm Beach Division, 701 Clematis Street, West Palm Beach, Palm Beach County, State of Florida, on the 6th day of February, 2007.¶
, Registered Merit Reporter and Notary Public was authorized to and did report the sworn testimony.¶
Thereupon,¶
a witness of lawful age, having been first duly sworn by the foreperson, testified on her oath as follows:¶
Q , please state and spell your name for the record.¶
A It is and I work for the FBI in Palm Beach County.¶
Q Can you spell your last name, please.¶
A I’m sorry, it is¶
Q And I know we have some people in the back having trouble hearing you. You said that you work for the FBI. Can you tell the Grand Jury what particular group you are employed with?¶
A I am with the¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085292¶
3¶
Palm Beach County, I work primarily crimes against children, but have been an agent for the last approximately 10 years.¶
Q Have you received specialized training in the area of crimes against children?¶
A Yes, I have.¶
Q As part of your employment with the FBI have you been involved in an investigation of Jeffrey Epstein?¶
A Yes, I have.¶
Q And can you tell us who Jeffrey Epstein is?¶
A Jeffrey Epstein is an investment advisor who has a part-time residence in the town of Palm Beach, he has got multiple residences across the country to include a ranch in New Mexico, an island in the Virgin Isles, and multiple aircrafts, two airplanes and a helicopter to be exact, and —¶
A His primary residence, he has an office in New York, but his primary residence I believe is the island.¶
Q And where is his primary residence?¶
Q In the Virgin Islands?¶
Q He also has a home in New York, correct?¶
A Yes.¶
A Yes.¶
Q How is it that you started investigating¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085293¶
4¶
Mr. Epstein?¶
A The Palm Beach Police Department in March of 2005 initiated an investigation on Mr. Epstein involving multiple underage females that had visited Mr. Epstein’s residence and had performed sexual massages or massages for Mr. Epstein of a sexual nature.¶
Mr. Epstein paid the underage females anywhere from 200 to $400, that investigation was around an 8 to 10-month investigation, and at that point we became involved in about July of 2006.¶
Q And once the case was presented to you by the Palm Beach Police Department did the FBI open its own investigation?¶
A Yes, yes, we initiated our investigation in July of 2006, we took a look at focusing in on the underage minors and in our investigation we interviewed many of the girls that were underage and we did an independent investigation issuing Grand Jury subpoenas as well as administrative subpoenas getting different documents of financial records, telephone analysis, flight manifests, looking to see if Mr. Epstein engaged in sexual activity with these females.¶
Q All right. And just so the Grand Jury is clear, were some of the girls who went to Mr. Epstein’s house 18 or older?¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085294¶
5¶
A Yes.¶
Q And then there were some that were under the age of 18, correct?¶
A Yes.¶
Q And as part of the federal investigation did you have to investigate what we call the interstate nexus aspect of the case?¶
A Yes.¶
Q And can you explain to the Grand Jury what that is?¶
A We looked at — Mr. Epstein, as I mentioned earlier, has two aircrafts, and we focused in on the year 2004, 2005, he took approximately 60 trips to his residence in Palm Beach, the majority of that time focusing in on his assistant’s cell phone, which his assistant’s name is , we took a look at her cell phone records and the majority of the times that Mr. Epstein would fly into Palm Beach Mrs. — Ms. would contact many of our underage victims either prior to coming into Palm Beach, the day of, the day before, even the day after, and certainly throughout the time that Mr. Epstein was at his residence in Palm Beach.¶
Q And from the interviews of the girls that have been conducted, what was the subject of those telephone calls?¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085295¶
6¶
EFTA00085296¶
7¶
interviews of the girls, is there anyone else who is associated with Mr. Epstein who is thought to be involved in this activity?¶
A has been referred to as his companion, girl friend, personal assistant, she through the testimony of the girls has engaged in sexual activity with at least three of the underage minors.¶
is also at least a subject of the investigation, correct?¶
A Yes, she is.¶
Q Now, as part of this investigation you mentioned that subpoenas were issued on behalf of either the old Grand Jury or this Grand Jury.¶
Can you run through what subpoenas have been issued and what documents have been received in response to that?¶
A Sure. We issued a Grand Jury subpoena to Colonial Bank and we received financial records on credit card accounts and individuals.¶
We subpoenaed Washington Mutual and they did a search and were unable to locate records at this time. We issued a Grand Jury subpoena for Capital One and served that and that is still unresolved at this time as far as them providing documents to us.¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085297¶
8¶
We have subpoenaed Chase Credit Card and we have received documents from Chase. We have subpoenaed two businesses that Mr. Epstein has at least partial ownership or associated to, Hyperion Air, Inc. and JEGE, Inc., they were issued subpoenas and they have provided documentation to us.¶
We have subpoenaed Mr. , who is a pilot of Mr. Epstein’s, and we have received documentation from . We have subpoenaed DTG Operations, who is doing business as Dollar Rent-A-Car, and we have received car rental agreements and financial records from that business.¶
We have subpoenaed Royal Palm Beach High School and have received documentation regarding the students’ records. We have subpoenaed three or four of the victims, being the first, and we have received a bathing suit from¶
We issued a Grand Jury subpoena to , we actually have issued three subpoenas, and we are still working on resolving her Grand Jury material as well as testimony.¶
We have issued a subpoena, we have issued — she also is one of our underage victims. We’ve issued Reimer Employment Agency a Grand Jury subpoena and we have received documentation, that is an¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085298¶
9¶
employment agency located on the island of Palm Beach.¶
Employment agency located on the island of Palm Beach. We have subpoenaed the Palm Beach Police Department for their evidence in this case and we have received that. By the way, that is the only thing that I did not bring with me today, I brought everything else, but it is rather a lot of evidence, so we will probably be bringing that to you another time.¶
We have issued the Clerk of Courts of the State of Florida for Grand Jury transcripts in the state matter and we have received those. We have issued the Good Samaritan Hospital for billing records and we have received those.¶
We have issued a Grand Jury subpoena to the Dalton School located in New York and at this time they do not have the records we have requested or could not locate those.¶
We have issued a Grand Jury subpoena to Extra Touch Flowers located here in West Palm Beach and we have received documentation from them. We issued a Grand Jury subpoena to , another pilot for Mr. Epstein, we have spoken with him.¶
We have issued a Grand Jury subpoena to another one of Mr. Epstein’s pilots, and we have received documentation as well as spoken to him. We have issued a Grand Jury subpoena to¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085299¶
10¶
who is the property manager currently for Mr. Epstein at his Palm Beach residence, and we have received documentation as well as spoken to him, and we have issued a Grand Jury subpoena to and have received some documentation and are still awaiting a response.¶
Q Now, you mentioned that you didn’t bring with you the evidence that you received from the Palm Beach Police Department, but did you bring with you all of the other evidence that was received in response to the subpoenas?¶
A I have.¶
Q And is that evidence in the two boxes that are here in the front?¶
A Yes.¶
Q We will bring all of this back to you when we present the indictment, but would anyone like to look at any of the documentation today?¶
A GRAND JUROR: What does the documentation constitute, basically, the subpoenas?¶
THE WITNESS: It is primarily business records, flight manifests, stuff that came from him traveling to and from Palm Beach, credit card records, the businesses as far as the rental agreement which involves some of the underage girls¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085300¶
11¶
with the rental cars, and flower shop, you know.¶
A GRAND JUROR: Will we have an opportunity later to go through these if we need to?¶
Yes, we will bring them when we present the indictment. Yes, ma’am.¶
A GRAND JUROR: If I should hold this for later let me know, she mentioned the hospital records were subpoenaed, could more information about why they were subpoenaed be provided at this time?¶
Q You can answer that.¶
A One of the girls that was an underage — that was underage at the time that is involved with Mr. Epstein has had a baby and we were interested and wondering if possibly he was the father of that baby, which at this time we do not believe he was.¶
A GRAND JUROR: Thank you.¶
: A question?¶
A GRAND JUROR: Did the flight manifest show passengers on the plane?¶
THE WITNESS: Yes, they do.¶
A GRAND JUROR: Were any of the passengers the underage girls that were a target of the investigation?¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085301¶
12¶
THE WITNESS: At this time we have not associated any of these underage girls as being the passengers. The flight manifests, sometimes the pilot if they did not know who the passenger was would put one passenger or one female, one male, these were private planes and they, you know, may not have felt like they can go up and ask, but we don’t have any evidence at this time to believe that they were any of our victims.¶
Any follow-up? Any other questions from the Grand Jury? Yes, ma’am.¶
A GRAND JUROR: The records that you subpoenaed from the high school, what were they used for or why were they instrumental in the investigation?¶
THE WITNESS: Those are the girls’ school records and we are just looking at the girls’ records.¶
A GRAND JUROR: Absenteeism?¶
THE WITNESS: Just looking at some of their grades and performances and how they did in school.¶
Ladies and gentlemen, before we continue, the witness has mentioned a few names of the minors and that is confidential information, obviously everything that you hear within these¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085302¶
13¶
Q Now, after — in addition to issuing the subpoenas, you mentioned that one of the subpoenas was to the Palm Beach Police Department. Did you review any of the evidence that they collected?¶
A Yes.¶
Q And can you, for example, did the Palm Beach Police Department interview any girls?¶
A Yes, they did, they interviewed several of the girls, most of the girls, they took taped statements from the girls either in the form of a tape-recorder or through video.¶
Q And you have reviewed some of those interviews, correct?¶
A Yes, we have.¶
Q And has the FBI performed any interviews?¶
A Yes, we have, we have performed interviews of past and current employees of Mr. Epstein as well as focusing in on the girls, the girls that were underage at the time of the sexual activity, we wanted to determine with these girls, again, the sexual activity that took place with Mr. Epstein as well as how old they were at the time, if they traveled with Mr. Epstein, any¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085303¶
14¶
gifts that they may have gotten, so we did reach out to several of the underage minors and gathered more information from them.¶
Q And through the FBI’s investigation has the FBI identified additional victims that perhaps the state police officers did not know about?¶
A Yes, we are still trying to identify, get first names of girls and going back and looking through school yearbooks and attempting to try to locate friends of friends, so we are still in the process, when you interview one of the girls and you ask if any of their friends went, they sometimes will give you other names, so we are in the process of still uncovering victims and reaching out and interviewing additional girls that we believe possibly were underage at the time of this sexual activity.¶
Q If I could ask you to step outside.¶
(The witness was excused from the Grand Jury room.)¶
EFTA00085304¶
15¶
coercion.¶
A When talking to the girls they were told that they may have to — they were going there to perform a massage, possibly model lingerie, they went there sometimes on multiple occasions and they may start off wearing their clothing and then he would instruct them to remove their clothing, the girls either performed these massages in the nude or keeping their underwear on.¶
As they went back again and again on some of the occasions the girls would take off more and more of their clothing, so when they first started they may be fully clothed and then when they came back he would instruct them to remove more of their clothing, so as far as coercion, they were paid $200 to $400 to perform these massages.¶
They are not trained in performing massages, they don’t — they are not masseuses, but yet if you ask if they were coerced, they were paid quite a bit of money for 30 to 45 minutes work.¶
Some of the girls, being that they were minors going to his residence, got in over their heads and did not always return or come back, some of our victims did not come back after, you know, they did go down to their thong underwear and Mr. Epstein did perform sexual acts¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085305¶
16¶
either by — and I didn’t get into that, but either by stroking their vagina on the outside of their panties or sometimes inside their panties as well as fondling them, and the girls, many of our victims did not realize that that was what was going to happen.¶
Q And was there one instance where Mr. Epstein actually engaged in vaginal intercourse with a girl against her will?¶
A Yes, he did, one of our victims who had been going there over a lengthy period of time had told Mr. Epstein on several occasions that he was not to do that and he did turn her around, threw her on the massage table and penetrated her.¶
Q A Grand Juror asked how old Mr. Epstein is.¶
A He was 45 at the time that we are looking at him at that time period.¶
Q A Grand Juror asked if you know the proportion of girls who were underage versus 18 or older.¶
A The majority of the girls that we are looking at are victims, well, all of our victims that we are looking at were under the age of 18.¶
As far as all of the girls that have been interviewed, the majority definitely were under 18. To give you a number, I would have to go and count, but I would say in the state investigation there were over 25¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085306¶
17¶
girls identified and more than a majority would have been under the age of 18.¶
Q A Grand Juror asked whether we have obtained Mr. Epstein’s DNA and whether there was any DNA testing of the baby that you spoke of earlier.¶
A No, we have not.¶
Q A Grand Juror asked how Mr. Epstein would make contact with the girls, was this done via computer or in some other method?¶
A I am sorry, his personal assistant, would contact, or on some occasions would also contact the girls via their cell phone and we have message pads from the residents that also indicate the girls calling the home in response to some of those phone calls, so they would call, would call, the majority of the calls were made by to the girls arranging for these, you know, can you come at this time, can you come at that time.¶
Q And is the cellular telephone a facility of interstate commerce?¶
A Yes, it is.¶
Q And then one of the Grand Jurors asked whether the assistants knew that the girls were underage or committed sex acts.¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085307¶
18¶
Did anybody, have you interviewed anybody who affirmatively told you that they told their age or what was going on behind closed doors?¶
A No, no, not at this time, not at this time.¶
Q And what leads you to believe that she, for example, knew or should have known what was going on?¶
A There are so many girls that contacted to give Mr. Epstein massages that have no training in massages, and that was aware that girls were bringing other girls, you know, their friends to do these massages.¶
was also making appointments for legitimate massages for Mr. Epstein from legitimate masseuses that would come and give him massages, so the number of girls, their appearances at the time would lead us to believe that had knowledge that these girls were underage.¶
Q All right. Thank you very much. Those were all the questions from the Grand Jury.¶
A GRAND JUROR: Actually, I have two more, but.¶
A GRAND JUROR: What was the actual age rang of these girls?¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085308¶
19¶
THE WITNESS: 14 to I mean.¶
A GRAND JUROR: The other one was, how did Ms.¶
actually originally get these girls, how were they brought in, I mean how were they, you know, because you said she called them when he was arriving, but how did these girls come into this in the first place?¶
A GRAND JUROR: Could she speak louder?¶
just had a request that you speak louder.¶
A GRAND JUROR: 14 and what?¶
THE WITNESS: Our victims were 14 to 17, but we have girls that are 18, we have girls that are 20, we have girls that are in their early 20s, and your question was?¶
A GRAND JUROR: How did she originally get them in in the first place?¶
THE WITNESS: We are focusing in on 2004, 2005, we have some evidence to show that this activity was taking place even earlier than that, certainly to include 2003 if you look at the message pads, but focusing in on 2004, 2005, the chain started with one of our minors and from that minor who goes to the house, Mr. Epstein tells her — sees that she is maybe not comfortable with¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085309¶
20¶
doing the massage the way he would like it and tells her that she could bring other girls to do the massages and she in fact if she brought another girl she would be paid $200 for just bringing another girl, so there starts the chain, and Mr. Epstein would ask the girls or would ask the girls for their phone numbers so each time, you know, if one of the girls brought a girl and he liked her he would ask for her phone number, ask her to leave the phone number, or would get the phone number and then that girl would maybe bring, because if you brought somebody you didn’t have to do the massage, but you also got paid for bringing a new person, so not only if you did the massage would you get anywhere from 200 to 400, but if you brought a new female you would receive 200 or $400.¶
A GRAND JUROR: Do you know how she solicited that original minor?¶
THE WITNESS: I don’t. Well, I know that minor was approached by two individuals and we have interviewed one of those individuals who we can connect back to Mr. Epstein four years, possibly, prior to this, and stated that his job was actually to drive some of the girls to the residence and¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085310¶
21¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085311¶
22¶
CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER¶
I certify pages 2 through 21 are a true transcript of my shorthand notes of the testimony of before the Federal Grand Jury, West Palm Beach, Florida on the 6th day of February, 2007.¶
OFFICIAL REPORTING SERVICE¶
EFTA00085312¶
Page 1¶
EFTA00085313¶
Page 2¶
The sworn testimony of was taken before the Federal Grand Jury, West Palm Beach Division, West Palm Beach, Palm Beach County, State of Florida, on the 27th day of February, 2007.¶
Court Reporter, was authorized to and did report the sworn testimony.¶
25¶
EFTA00085314¶
Page 3¶
having been duly sworn by the grand jury foreperson, was examined and testified on her oath as follows:¶
you restate and spell your name for the record.¶
Q Can you remind the grand jury who you are employed by?¶
A The FBI.¶
Q I know that you testified here a few weeks ago. Was there anything from that testimony that you wanted to correct?¶
A I did. I was asked by one of you Mr. Epstein’s age, and I confused him with another individual in another one of my cases. His birthdate is January 20, 1953. We are looking at the time period of 2004 and 2005. So Mr. Epstein would have been about 51 or 52-years-old, and I believe I told you he was 45. So at the time we’re looking during this investigation, he is 51 or 52.¶
Q how did this case first come to the attention of the police?¶
EFTA00085315¶
EFTA00085316¶
Page 5¶
A She was a ninth-grader there.¶
Q You mentioned that her called the Palm Beach police department. What did the police department do in response to that call?¶
A They wanted to interview . I believe it was the next day they went out to where was attending school at that time, which I think was They interviewed at and wanted to get her side of what took place.¶
Q Because we’ll be referring to this throughout, what was the name of the detective who conducted that first interview?¶
A Detective¶
Q So in March of 2005, detective talked with¶
Was ever interviewed at any other times?¶
A Yes. She was interviewed — they talked to her again. She placed some controlled calls for them later that month, we will talk about that later. As well as she was interviewed about a year later in July of 2006. Not interviewed, but she testified before the grand jury for the State of Florida. So she was interviewed by detective Pagan in March of 2005, and then about a year or three or four months later, in July of 2006, she testified before a grand jury with the State of Florida.¶
Q In preparation for your appearance today, did¶
EFTA00085317¶
EFTA00085318¶
Page 7¶
EFTA00085319¶
Page 8¶
EFTA00085320¶
Page 9¶
another girl in the car, . So the two of them arrive at residence, and they continue over to Mr. Epstein’s house.¶
A You know, I’m not sure how they were sitting, but I know that it was a pickup truck that drove, and was the driver. I’m not sure exactly the placement of the other two girls, but they were in the truck.¶
Q And was able to describe how they travelled to the island of Palm Beach?¶
A Yes. She gave directions — you know, the best that she could on how she was able to come to Mr. Epstein’s residence.¶
Q Once they arrived at the residence, what happened?¶
A I should have mentioned that either the night before or the day of, there were some things that tells. One, she tells that she is to tell, if asked, that she is 18-years-of-age, that she attends high school, that she’s in the 12th grade, and I believe it was Wellington High School that she was to say that she went to.¶
Talking to last night, told us that¶
EFTA00085321¶
Page 10¶
once she arrived at the residence tells her that she may possibly be asked to take her clothes off. She also tells her that she can stay in her bra, but she may be asked to take her clothes off. And told us last night that that’s when she knew for the first time that she might have to possibly remove her clothes.¶
At this point they proceed to enter the residence. describes him as a security person. He approached and asked what they were doing there, and said they were there to see Mr. Epstein, or see Jeffrey. He allowed them entry into the kitchen area by the pool, and describes that area. So now and are all sitting in the kitchen. A short time goes by and Mr. Epstein, as well as the assistant, enter the kitchen.¶
Q And I know that you mentioned that did not know the name of the lady who was there in the kitchen, correct?¶
A Right.¶
Q She just described her as a blonde, tall lady?¶
A Yes.¶
Q Was also interviewed about what happened that day?¶
A She was interviewed by the Palm Beach police department.¶
EFTA00085322¶
Page 11¶
A follows the blonde lady upstairs to Mr. Epstein’s bedroom. The blonde lady proceeds to take out a massage table and set it up, prepare it. She also takes out some lotions to be used during the massage.¶
told me last night that the blonde lady asked her to remove her clothing, and then left the room and said that Mr. Epstein would be in shortly.¶
A Shortly after that, Mr. Epstein does come into the room and shakes his hand. told us last night that Mr. Epstein told her to remove her clothing. He leaves the room and comes back in just a towel, and he tells her again to — she is at that point — when he walked in the first time she had on her bra and her pants.¶
EFTA00085323¶
Page 12¶
When he comes back in, he tells her that she needs to take her pants off. So she took her pants off. So now she’s in her bra and underwear.¶
Q At some point did Sage tell any of the people who interviewed her what was running through her mind?¶
A She stated at one point that she was upstairs with him, with the man, and that was downstairs. I guess she says, “What could do? She’s downstairs, I’m upstairs.” So she did what she was asked to do.¶
Q So now you mention that Mr. Epstein is here wearing just a towel, and has removed both her shirt and her pants, is that correct?¶
A Mr. Epstein gets on the massage table lying on his stomach and instructs how to do the massage. He tells her to put some lotion on her hand and instructs her on how to actually perform the massage. At one point during the massage he tells that she would be more comfortable to get on top of him, so gets on top of him and straddles Mr. Epstein’s back.¶
The way describes it is Mr. Epstein is laying on the table, he has a towel covering his bottom, and she is straddling him with her bottom touching the towel and some skin touching his lower back. She was kind¶
EFTA00085324¶
Page 13¶
of sitting — it sounds like sitting on his rear end, but with part of her skin touching him — the front of him, but he had a towel across his bottom.¶
Q What happens as she is providing the massage to his back?¶
A The massage goes on. She said the entire massage lasted anywhere from 30 to 45 minutes. At one point Mr. Epstein excuses himself for a few minutes, one or two minutes briefly. □ states that she can hear Mr. Epstein moaning or groaning, and states that she believes he was, in her words, “wacking off” or masturbating. She didn’t say masturbating, she said “wacking off.” I am going to use that she believes he was masturbating.¶
Then he returns. At this point he gets back on the table lying on his back and asks her to start massaging his chest. So she begins to massage his chest.¶
Q Does he keep the towel on?¶
A No, at this point the towel is removed. When he comes back and he gets back on the table, the towel is removed and she is massaging his chest.¶
Q What does he do as she is massaging his chest?¶
A He moves his hand up and down his penis. So he continued to masturbate on the table. He asked at some point during this time, if she would like to make an¶
EFTA00085325¶
Page 14¶
extra $100. He tells her that it would not involve doing a massage. agrees. He asked her if he could use a vibrator on her, and she does agree. describes it as a purple vibrator that was used and she said this goes on for about ten minutes.¶
Q What did she say happened when Mr. Epstein digitally penetrated her?¶
A The vibrator is used. At some point he does her. And these are her words. She looks at him kind of funny, and he sarcastically — which is her word — he sarcastically says, “What’s the matter?” And she at that point just kind of looks away, and he continues on with the In the last three to four minutes of that, he begins to masturbate again.¶
At the conclusion of the sexual activity, Mr. Epstein wipes his penis off with a towel. was asked if he ejaculated. She did not see him ejaculate, but saw him wipe his penis off with a towel.¶
Q Was able to provide a physical description of Mr. Epstein?¶
A Yes.¶
EFTA00085326¶
Page 15¶
1 Q Including of his penis?¶
2 A Yes.¶
Q Was she also able to provide a description of her surroundings in that massage area?¶
A Yes.¶
Q Was that description accurate?¶
A Yes. According to other testimony we have gotten from other victims, yes.¶
Q And a search was performed on Mr. Epstein’s house?¶
A Yes. The Palm Beach police department did perform a search, and several of the items that were described were found in the house.¶
Q After Mr. Epstein wiped himself off, what happened?¶
A He told that she was getting the extra hundred dollars because he was allowed to use the vibrator on her and The massage had been concluded, the sexual activity had been concluded. He gets up and leaves for a brief moment of time and comes back with $300 and pays the $300. I believe he told that she could see herself out.¶
Q Before we leave that room, when was either being directed to the room or was inside that room where the massage took place, was there anything in particular¶
EFTA00085327¶
EFTA00085328¶
Page 17¶
Mr. Epstein’s house that day, and that they were going to go shopping after she got her money, and that could make some money.¶
Q During that ride, did realize that received money from Mr. Epstein?¶
A Yes. At some point knows that received $200, but is unsure that ever gave a massage. So at that particular time did not know why she had gotten the $200, because she didn’t think that had had time to give a massage.¶
Q In interview, did she explain what she got the $200 for?¶
A told the Palm Beach police department in her interview that she received her $200 for bringing to the house.¶
Q You mentioned that there were these three different time periods that was interviewed: Shortly after the events, at the time of the state grand jury proceedings, and when you met with her, correct?¶
A Yes.¶
Q And there were some discrepancies between the different interviews. Can you explain some of those to the grand jury.¶
A Before we go and get to that, I want to make sure that — when we discussed what was told in the¶
EFTA00085329¶
Page 18¶
EFTA00085330¶
Page 19¶
Mr. Epstein’s residence, that did tell her that she may be asked to take off her clothes. She also did state that told her she could stay in her bra.¶
So I wanted you to know that there was a discrepancy in what she originally had told detective Pagan and what she told me last night. That would be one.¶
The second discrepancy I wanted to touch on with her was going upstairs and taking off her clothing. When she is in that room, she states to detective that asked her to remove her clothing, and she took off her shirt. Then Mr. Epstein came in the room, shook her hand and told her to take off her clothes. He leaves, he comes back in a towel. He tells her again. tells detective in a stern voice, “Mr. Epstein told me to take off my pants.” Because she hadn’t taken off her pants from the first time that she met him.¶
In her testimony with the grand jury with the state, she tells the grand jury that it was who asked her to remove her clothing. So last night we went over with her who told her to remove what. She had a very hard time recalling exactly. She knew she had gotten down to her bra and underwear. And then at some point, when we’re going through the sexual activity, she actually tells me that her underwear was off when he was using the vibrator and¶
EFTA00085331¶
Page 20¶
Later in the interview, we tell her about what we have in her testimony to the grand jury and her statements made to detective . And she really is having a difficult time trying to remember who told her to take off her clothes and her pants. As we are walking through the sexual activity, she does recall and states that it was Mr. Epstein who told her to take off her pants.¶
I guess I’ll go to the third discrepancy. Is there anything I left off with that?¶
Q Well, does she report that when the assistant leads — or the blonde lady leads her upstairs, that the blonde lady also said, “Get undressed,” but that didn’t get fully undressed?¶
A That’s what she said in her statement to the detective, when she gives her first statement. She tells us again last night that that’s what she recalled.¶
Q That the lady said first, “Get undressed,” but she doesn’t get fully undressed. And when Jeffrey comes back, he said, “Take your pants off.”?¶
A Yes. And again, like I said, when we started interviewing her and asking her about this, she did have a hard time. But when we were walking through the sexual activity, that’s when she recalls who told her to take off her pants.¶
EFTA00085332¶
Page 21¶
And I’ll tell you, when we talked about the sexual activity, and it comes out that she wasn’t wearing her underwear when he was her and using the vibrator, she does not recall how they came off. She cannot remember removing her underwear. She doesn’t remember if Mr. Epstein removed her underwear. She knows her underwear was off, but she cannot tell you exactly at what point her underwear was removed.¶
Q Let’s talk about the third discrepancy.¶
A The third is the sexual activity, when she was originally interviewed by detective Pagan about the vibrator or being When detective Pagan comes and sees her again a few weeks later, she does tell her at that time that a vibrator was used on her. She also says that to the grand jury, she talks about the purple vibrator being used on her.¶
Last night she told us about the purple vibrator being used on her. When we asked her about him her, and that had told the police department that she had bee told us last night that she by Mr. Epstein, but that she thought only her and knew about this and that she did not want her father to know that her. She didn’t want anybody to know, but she especially didn’t want her father to know, that that was her business. That¶
EFTA00085333¶
Page 22¶
she did not know that had told anybody, she thought it was only her and that knew. She was embarrassed and didn’t want anybody to know that.¶
Q Did she become visually upset?¶
Yes, she began crying when we asked her about being When she realized that we knew about that, she became very upset and concerned about her father. She mentioned that her father has read a lot of the reports in the State of Florida, and has followed the state’s case. She was concerned about even telling us, afraid that he would be able to read in our reports about this.¶
We explained to her that the FBI’s reporting is a little bit different than the way the state — those are public records, and ours is part of our case file.¶
Q In addition to the fact that she had these concerns about her father and she was embarrassed, in your experience of interviewing victims of sexual abuse, is it typical for them to not disclose all of the sexual activity?¶
A Yes, it’s very typical. And young girls, they don’t want to talk about it. This is just another case of her not wanting to tell exactly what took place.¶
Q After that first visit to Mr. Epstein’s house, and the interviews with detective did detective¶
EFTA00085334¶
EFTA00085335¶
EFTA00085336¶
Page 25¶
Q On April 1, the following day, did make calls to ?¶
A From the Palm Beach police department, they were able to take voice mail messages left by on phone stating that could come and work on Saturday around 11:00.¶
Q Was there anything of value related to this series of calls that were recovered?¶
Q I think you mentioned this last time, but in case you didn’t, did the Palm Beach police department do trash pulls at Mr. Epstein’s house?¶
EFTA00085337¶
Page 26¶
EFTA00085338¶
Page 27¶
with, and her parents were in the front seat. He told that they were having sex in the back seat — were doing sexual things in the back seat while he was carrying on a conversation with the parents in the front seat. I guess they were on their way home from a business party. This was one of the stories that he had talked about.¶
Q But at no time did he provide any specific ages about any of those girls?¶
EFTA00085339¶
EFTA00085340¶